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Discussion in 'Lamborghini Discussion (not model specific)' started by zjpj, Nov 23, 2003.
Was this just a wild rumor, or is it actually going to happen? Any news?
Its more than a "wild rumor" and less than a sure thing. If/When It goes into production it will use the VW/Porsche/Audi platform and likeley use a version of the Gallardo engine. The name of the project is/was Borneo...
I dont particularly enjoy the prospect of another "performance SUV" (oxymoron?) but this one sounds interesting...
I really hope they don't follow every other manufacturer down the SUV road.
Bring on an evolution of the Espada!
It would be cool if Lambo brought back the LM. I actually used to like those monsters. I used to see more of those around than Countachs.
The problem is that if you put the Gallardo engine in, then your everyday SUV is going to need servicing like the Gallardo - in other words, more frequency than standard and more $$$. The great thing about the Cayenne is that it doesn't cost $ like getting a Ferrari tuned up, let's say - the oil only needs to be changed every 10 or 15 thousand miles, engine tuneup after 100K. But, can you imagine driving an LM002 everyday, with a Countach engine - it would be in the shop even more than an old 1980s Range Rover!
Obviously, an SUV with a Gallardo engine would be absolutely amazing for people who need four wheel drive and cargo space, but at the same time they would be taking all of the practicality out of the concept.
Or, they can rebadge a Touareg, stick flip up doors on it, chrome wheels, a few scoops and wings, stickers all over the sides, and call it a Lambo. More or less what they did to the Gallardo by taking an Audi product and rebadging it with new body.
Which Audi did they rebadge? The one that won LeMans 3 times?
How is this any different than Ferrari using Audi to help with their Kubang?
Oil change on the turbo Cayenne is at 20K.
Dont mind Ernesto, he drives a banana 360. Youd be pissed too.
The Gallardo is the upcoming VW Quattro Le Mans with new sheetmetal. Same chassis, engine (sans turbos), tranny, etc etc. This Audi DID NOT win the Le Mans race three times. There is a difference between using technology to help build something, and simply REBADGING a product with new sheet metal. Seems VW always keeps the best designs for themselves, a la Cayenne and Touareg.
Funny, this coming from somebody who drives a banana 355 and riced out, chromed out Diablo. LOL....
Audi is not building the Quattro LeMans.
Once again how is this different than Audi helping Ferrari with the Kubang?
How will any of this be different if VW buys Ferrari which is far from impossible?
You like the Touareg over theTurbo Cayenne.
My wife didn't.
You have a 360.
I have a P4.
None of this has anything to do with any of us as individuals.
This is about dismissing great cars based on what some mag said as opposed to driving and owning them and coming to a IMHO a more enlightened place than: "Lambo's are Audi's and they suck!"
Lambo's are great cars. You may not like them or want one but they are great cars.
IMHO before paying over MSRP. for 360 Spyder one should consider a used Murcie. I think it's much more car for the $.
Jim, you seem to think this is a pissing contest about whose car is better. It's not. I'm glad you have a P4 and you are enjoying it. I have a 360, and I am enjoying it as well. You dont have to defend you, or your wife's tastes. You like what you like.
I am not dismissing anything. I *LOVE* Lambos, Ferraris, Maseratis, etc etc. However, I would not trade my 360 for any post-Miura Lambo and have it as my only exotic. I dont like their styling. But thats not the point of this. The point is that several people have told me that the Quattro LM will go into production at a detuned level. It is VERY DIFFERENT to take a product and rebadge it (a la Touareg/Cayenne, Gallardo/Quattro) and using technology to build something of your own. If you cant see the difference, them I cant explain it any better.
PS. By the way, there is no way in hell that the powers that be in Italy (including Government, Society, Public, etc) will let a German company take control of Ferrari, which is considered national patrimony.
The people who told you that Audi is going to build the LeMans Quatro are wrong.
I guess the Enzo/ Maser 6000GT isn't badge engineering?
I guess FIAT isn't desparetly trying to sell out to GM?
I guess Luca was merely fooling when he announced the alliance with Audi and introduced himself as the latest member of the VW board?
(For the time being he was kidding about the VW board but as for Ferrari selling out to VW that is by no means impossible. They've already sold a major portion of their co to Lehman Bros. who last time I looked wern't Italian)
Jim, you could very well end up being correct regarding the LM Quattro production, and my information is probably not as good as yours. I hope it makes it though, because it is MUCH better looking than the Gallardo and I could very well be a buyer.
When they release the Maserati 6000GT, then we can talk about badge engineering. I have been told it will look nothing like the Enzo.
Regarding Audi, they can enter into techonological agreements and other collaborations (Audi is a GREAT car company, and I have owned a few models myself), but in the end they are not sharing platforms, engines, trannies, etc etc. If they do, then Ferrari will lose me as a customer.
Lastly, I'll restate my previous statement/opinion. Ferrari will never be sold to a German company, as it is much more than a just a company in Italy.
Read the press release on Audi/Maser.
Note what they're sharing.
Read the press release on the Enzo/Maser 6000GT. Note what they're sharing. It seems like badge engineering to me.
As for Italy NEVER selling to a German Co. There was a time they got along quite well...
I pray you are right. I was thinking that fiat was going to transfer lancia and alfa to the masi/ferrari group and make a complete new company with a complete heiarchy. James that is what you said in a number of posts on the old site. What happened to that?
I think that was someone else who mentioned Alfa/Lancia although I read that as well. The problem as I see it is that it is very hard as a small co. to compete with the might of a larger co. At times like these I remember the words of Karl Marx in "Das Kapital"
"In the end there will be one co and the government will take that over..."
As my friend Jim said: "Strange Days..."
James, then why can't it be BMW? That would be awesome.... They are my second fav. company.
Interesting statement, and I would agree that the Murcie is more car for the money. However, for some people, there is no substitute for the open-air motoring experience that the Spider offers. I am one of those people. I would consider buying a Murcie to complement my 360 Spider, but not to replace it. Now, if Lambo could figure out a way to make the Murcie look attractive in a convertible version, that would make things really interesting. The only problem is that the huge rear-end of the Murcie makes for a challenging open-top design. The Diablo Roadster was an example of this, which I think is one of the ugliest exotic car designs to date. The hardtop Diablo is attractive, but the Roadster is like the ugly duckling.
I don't know - I always liked the last Lambo truck!
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Here's another - I'm like a 2 piece jigsaw puzzle - I'm easy!
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Oh yeah, the LM002 was awesome. too bad most of them are used to drive around oil fields instead of being available to us in the U.S. At least in the Near East they probably went off road....
It would be interesting to see, since the Gallardo was designed to compete with the 360 - it's really weird to see a company competing against itself.
That being said, I would be dissapointed if Ferrari went to VW, or anyone else for that matter. HOWEVER, I don't feel like Bentley has lost any of its Britishness, so maybe they could keep Ferrari's flair. They just better not Porsche-ify the exhaust note!
The LM is a beast!
I have seen a few on ebay in the last year for 50-60k. Wonder how it is to fix / get parts for. Anyone know someone who owned one?